Surgery

RLHoLEP Case 35: En bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP 400 grams

Dr. Fernando Gómez Sancha · ICUA

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Dr. Fernando Gómez Sancha · YouTube

Language: English. YouTube audio metadata.

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RLHoLEP Case 35: En bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP 400 grams

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About this video

An en-bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP in a patient in urinary retention, with an estimated prostate size of 400 grams. The description reports a three-hour operation that required division of the prostate at the end and some intracapsular morcellation. It also reports discharge without a catheter the following morning; this outcome belongs to the documented individual case.

This is a recent challenging case, a patient with an estimated size of 400 grams prostate in retention. The operation took 3 hours, but we were able to complete the enucleation and send the patient home without a catheter the next morning. We had to split the prostate at the end, and do some intracapsular morcellation to be able to finish.

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Only details explicitly stated in the sources. Missing information does not mean it did not occur.

En bloc
RLHoLEP Case 35: En bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP 400 grams
Virtual Basket
RLHoLEP Case 35: En bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP 400 grams
Documented challenging case
This is a recent challenging case, a patient with an estimated size of 400 grams prostate in retention. The operation took 3 hours, but we were able to complete the enucleation and send the pat
Urinary retention
t challenging case, a patient with an estimated size of 400 grams prostate in retention. The operation took 3 hours, but we were able to complete the enucleation and send the patient home without a catheter the next morning. We had to split the pr
400 g
RLHoLEP Case 35: En bloc Virtual Basket HoLEP 400 grams
Intracapsular morcellation
We had to split the prostate at the end, and do some intracapsular morcellation to be able to finish.
Splitting the adenoma
We had to split the prostate at the end
Original title and description on YouTube

Source checked: 2026-10-06.

Available transcript · English

Subtitles exported from the original-language YouTube Studio editor. Not clinically reviewed; source identity and timestamps verified, full audio coverage not verified.

Selected spellings of enucleation, morcellation and holmium terms have been edited. This is not a full audio or clinical review; the original captions remain the source.

They may contain transcription or translation errors; check the explanation in the video.

  1. hello this is sancho and this is another case of a holmium enucleation of the prostate in a  patient with a 400 gram prostate gland it is an extreme case we don't usually see too many  patients with this kind of prostate volume but with experience i have seen that it is  feasible to operate these larger glands although some things change a little bit in  the way we prepare the the patient uh what we tell him and how we perform  the operation we are quite convinced that it is possible to nucleate very  very large glands carefully in this cases my main concern is to protect the  sphincter and of course it takes longer because it is much more surface that we have to  dissect and it is much more tissue that
  2. we have to morsel it so basically when i speak  to the patient i tell you know we're going to try to do this endoscopically but there is a  chance that we might have to do a second stage or there is a chance that we might need to do a  cystotomy to to remove a very large gland also i question them what would you like  would you that rather have a small wound below the umbilicus or would you rather have  a second stage you see that it's very typical if you force your entry a little bit into the bladder  there might be some 12 o'clock split in the mucosa and here i'm marking the the white line just  like any other uh case of and blocking nucleation so marking the white line  what you will notice is that
  3. the progress is a little bit slower because  we want to pay as we go with hemostasis so i think in this very large glance when you're  going to have a very rough and very large surface of dissection it's important to to take  good care of hemostasis as you go and even to stop and perform hemostasis if you need to so  this is again the white line trying to demarcate trying to incise the mukusa in the interface  between adenoma and sphincter trying to have a reference for the rest of the procedure and um  that will help protect the sphincter and make make the procedure much safer of course for  for the patient so this is the entry into the plane here you can see that i'm moving  much slower than usually because i want the
  4. hemostatic effect of of virtual baskets to to  really provide a reliable hemistasis as as we go this is the entry the development of the posterior  plane below the apex of the right side of of the prostate you see we have a nice place a nice  plane and you see how holmium helps spreading the plane opening the plane and with  virtual basket of course and moses we have observed much better hemispheres this is  the access now to the to the other side i don't know there are many factors  when you do a very large gland like this you have to be extremely calm and you have  to be extremely patient because and also you have to trust the method you have to trust the  step-by-step approach that you're going to follow
  5. so if you progress slowly if you carry out  carry on with the operation trying to make every movement count every movement when i go  to the right when i go to the left i try to to make sure that it is a movement that is  going to add uh something to to the procedure so in this case i think it was nearly one hour  and a half the the most the nucleation time and then it took us one hour and a half to do the  morcellation for some reason most later was not at its peak efficiency uh and it took a  little bit while longer than we expected but this patient was then sent home the next  morning without a catheter which is a big big big success for such a for such a case so  here you can see how i always try to have a line
  6. that i can follow i do wide movements from side to  side usually a little bit faster but in this case as i said it's it's it's paramount to have a good  hemistasis and to make sure that the hemostasis will be reliable as you progress so i'm not  in a hurry and i progress much more slowly in the larger glands trying to  uh get this wonderful hemistasis of course these cases are challenging and i  think it's very important to use the the smaller glance to train your ability to perform hollop to  train your ability to make every movement count and of course to increase the knowledge  about anatomy i have edited the video of course it's not going to be three hours it's  going to be a little bit less than an hour
  7. but i have selected those relevant pieces  of video that will hopefully illustrate how one of these prostates can  be performed can be done so now we have a posterior line of dissection  you see that i try to keep my scope so i can see the line more or less in the  middle of the screen so i can get to see a little bit of adenoma  and a little bit of capsule and the dissection line is in the middle  the line of attack the line of dissection i of course now turn the fiber towards  12 o'clock that's the sphincter with the split that we saw and  here i'm trying to certain where where's the limit that's probably the white  line more or less and you can see that we incise a little bit on the adenoma  initially to gain better access
  8. and to allow me to start the mobilization of the  lateral plane i see we have done the posterior line and now i'm going to carefully try to do  a little bit of mobilization of the lateral apex and that will open up the  way to the lateral lateral aspect and then of course you have  to progress a little bit towards the bladder neck because we want to  have good mobility of the tip of the noma and that's already the interior part on  the right side coming up you see from below and it's so [Music] nice if you can  detach a little bit of the interior part as well because that will make the the apex fall a  little bit you know descend a little bit from the ceiling so when we are going to see the 12 o'clock  tissue it will be much easier so this is the other
  9. side now here again i'm trying to find out  where was the marking of the white line and you know make sure because the the adnoma the  shape of the anoma and the on the plane you have found posteriorly will give you information as  well about the anatomy of the apex and this first incision on the adnoma is important because it  tends to detach it a little bit from the sphincter you know many people do not understand this  very well but i would say that it is similar to if you remember when you when you do a frayer  uh open prostatectomy you are inside the bladder and you can see the middle lobe popping  inside the the bladder and you see the eos and then typically the first thing you  do is you make an incision in the mucosa
  10. that will take you to the plane uh so  here we do the same we do this incision that will uh make sure that the sphincter and  the epixel will be detached and that allows us to enter this lateral plane so here again there  is a little bit of dissection towards the bladder neck we want to mobilize the apex so you need  to go a little bit towards the bladder neck so that early apical dissection doesn't mean that  you're going to do an immediate apocalypse section it's not something you do right away just  as you enter but it means that you carefully mobilize the the apex so that progressively  you get better access to the anterior part and instead of forcing the sphincter upwards  to get to that point what you do is you you
  11. release the apex and that mobility that you gain  allows you to to to access the 12 o'clock region not by pushing up against the sphincter  and distending the sphincter but more allowing the the the apex to descend a little bit  so that you can cut the 12 o'clock fibers without much tension and traction so here you can see  that the apex has descended and that's the only remaining 12 o'clock fibers that we found  in this case of course uh all well within uh the safety uh for the sphincter so the sphincter  has been left distally now and we can now connect and work to fabricate the anterior line of  dissection of course sometimes getting all the way up to the real plane anteriorly takes a little  bit of work you might enter this plane from one
  12. side and not from there from both sides so there  might be some discrepancy that you have to correct but basically what we have achieved at this  stage which i think is very important is to release the sphincter so when the scope now  moves around the adnoma there won't be more distension of the sphincter the sphincter  will be closed around the endoscope so this is it this is the anterior line of course  we also want to keep good hemostasis anteriorly and it's just just like any other hollap  but of course the dimensions are bigger and you have to progress a little bit slower you see  that the plane is excellent there so anatomically we are in a very safe situation and  if you're careful and you progress
  13. carefully slowly then everything  is going to be all right that's again the dissection  plus coagulation i'm not so interested in running you know just i'm interested  in trying to get a good field where i can see what i'm doing and this is another of the advantages  of the unblock technique that the irrigation fluid is not coming in and out of the bladder the  irrigation fluid is staying in this little cavity that we are developing so it's very  efficient and if there is a bleeder the blood will be washed out very efficiently as well so we  will keep good visibility throughout the procedure of course you will see that in this case i  couldn't do a pure and block i had to split the adenoma at the end because it was not possible  to flip the gland into the into the bladder
  14. and also reaching the six o'clock area just below  the the bladder neck was quite a challenge so but uh we we managed and i think it's it's  impressive thing we managed to do an endoscopic uh procedure to remove such a large gland the  patient was kept in the hospital overnight and the next morning we took out the catheter  and he went away he's telling me that he has an excellent flow and excellent urinary  continent so it is it is really a miracle i think that we can do such cases of course you know my  approach would be or has been more progressive in the sense that i have tried to tackle  sizes you know progressively bigger sizes and when when i had to face these cases as i said  i just tell the patient you know this is quite
  15. difficult and i hope we can do it in one  stage maybe we have to do a second stage but i think we can do this in a minimally  invasive fashion minimally invasive fashion that's the development of the plane on the other  side and as i said it is important to keep working in a way that there is some progress  every minute so every minute you should be better than a minute before  because you have dissected more and i don't care so much about the bleeders in  the side of that norma because these are going to stop spontaneously but if there is a  bleeder in the capsule of course we want to to coagulate it as soon as possible but you see  that there was some blood poured into the cavity but the irrigation is so good that we keep having  excellent visibility i try to keep the lines you
  16. know if you if you have seen the mri or the ct  scan sorry that i presented at the beginning especially when you watch mris now that we do  so many mris of prostate you can always see that the line around the anoma is quite congruent so i think we shouldn't be so obsessed with seeing  the beautiful plane we have seen before uh but so i i don't try to see the plane and i think it's  a mistake probably to try to see the the plane uh us as this beautiful  glistening surface you know plane that we all can recognize perfectly i would  say that i would rather concentrate on watching the the capsular [Music] surface and watching  its features you know if it is fibrous if it is more or less uh smooth if it is devoided of of  anomalous tissue you know the the noma tends to be
  17. more yellow and the capsule tends to be more white  i think even and also very importantly if the line is congruent i mean if you come from a  place where you see that the plane is good and you follow this line and the line is congruent  and the tissue characteristics and the capsule tell you this is probably capsule then you are  okay you know and that's why i care less and less about actually seeing this this plane  and sometimes we have uh of course nice uh indirect signs like this here you can  see this is a nice plane that is peeling off so that tells us that our line is in the  right depth and that we can follow uh this line and everything is coherent you see we  are connecting with the line before be below so
  18. the lines are very important and keeping one only single line that you can recognize you  know and you can follow will help you a great deal this is now the sign that we  are entering the bladder i was not sure that uh this was i could just push inside so i  decided to develop a little bit more around the sides to have a better view of of the bladder  neck area here logically we find the arteries flock arteries coming to the  prostate so near the bladder neck and sometimes we struggle a little bit to coagulate them but again just be patient and try to to see the vessel and fire against  the base of the vest bezel and try to find the distance that does the trick here again  we can see the plane is very beautiful
  19. and the line is congruent and we are connecting  with the lateral plane with the posterior plane here of course targeting is also very important  you know at the beginning of the procedure i focus on firing against the line but as the  equator of the enoma is reached and we are now in the midway between the sphincter and the  bladder neck often the direction of the plane start to change this is a pseudo spherical adnoma  so when you want to navigate one of these corners navigate one of these planes that change direction  you have to start changing your aiming so instead of aiming against the line which is you see at  this angle of incidence if i fire against the line i will probably deepen in the line what i do is i  fire a little bit on the side of the anoma so not
  20. not against the line but against the side  of the adnoma and that will allow you to cut the fibers that are keeping together the  noma and the capsule while not uh penetrating too much in the in the in the capsule so if  you look carefully at the targeting i use you will see that often when we are getting  closer to the bladder neck the fiber is firing um more close more close to the enormous so the  first half of the procedure the targeting is against the line of dissection and  that is okay because the planes are opening a little bit towards lateral  towards posterior towards anterior but then the direction of the planes change here  i'm doing some hemistasis as i said i want to run a very reliable hemistasis and it's uh  very interesting to see that even when i did
  21. the dissection rather slow there is some  red color in the surface which means that holmium provides very good hemostasis but it  doesn't deepen too much so it's it's quite respectful uh hemostasis this is this tissue is  not fried it's not cooked you know it doesn't go too deep so that is quite nice i think of course  we always want better and better hemispheres and i think virtual basket and moses are quite good  for that for the a nice first plasmostasis but we find prostates very large prostates  prostates with maybe a slightly more difficult plane sometimes that tend to  bleed a little bit more than others so i would say hemostasis has improved a  lot it makes our life much easier but it is not perfect uh i think with any laser that  is the ejaculatory duct so when you see that
  22. uh you don't need to panic we just are a  little bit deep uh in the dissection and you have to correct your plane and you  know go over over the the educator reduct but this something we see quite often and  something that clinically has no consequence usually i think in the majority of  patients it has it has no consequence again this area is full with little arteries so you have to be patient to let  the tissue get whiter coagulated and sometimes it's hard to to fight with these  bigger bigger arteries you see the fiber has 0.5 millimeters so this artery probably has  a similar caliber so try to deliver energy towards the vessel but of course it's a very very big flow of energy sorry of blood and sometimes  it takes a little while to control
  23. this is especially patent i think with  when you use low power lasers so that's why you know the whole low power discussion i think it's very beautiful but when you have to  do a challenging case i think high power provides much better you know it's it's a much  better companion a tool that will allow you to to tackle even this this larger glance if it's  very difficult and you know you get impatient and you think you're not cutting it you're not  achieving the hemostasis you want there's no sin in changing for a moment or a sectorscope and  maybe use the rolly ball to to coagulate such such big big vessels and then return to the laser  you see remember we did a small opening up there i was not sure so i i thought i'm going to because  there is some risk of you know going a little bit
  24. anterior to the to the to the bladder uh neck if  if you're not careful and here we are seeing um also circular fibers and vertical fibers below so  i decided to test this now and we i thought i saw something behind and that's the huge middle lobe  but of course we are entering the the bladder and and to check and to learn of course because  we keep on learning you see this is the way i was carrying before and uh you know it  was not so bad and it would have led us into the bladder uh again so when you watch these  circular fibers with the vertical fibers below typically that will take you into the bladder so that's a section of the ladder  neck bladder neck mucosa trying to cut the bladder neck downwards
  25. oh you see it's like like any other case  but it takes longer and their dimensions are much much larger here for example i'm doing a little bit of contact  i know that behind that there's the bladder so i don't mind doing contact sometimes  contact helps you cut a very fibrous tissue so i often use the fiber in contact  when i am in a safe safe place and when i'm not worried that deepening  the plane will will be dangerous and it helps a little bit i think the  increases the efficiency of the cutting because almost almost touching when the tissue  is very fibrous and here of course we want to see the original orifices which  are a little bit lifted up by the growth of the adnoma big middle lobe and now you see  we can go all around uh that was the urethra
  26. and again if you start seeing too much  red it doesn't i mean it's always based off to stop for a moment and make sure  that hemostasis gets better and better it's a big surface and you need to be  systematic and careful if you want to pull this that's the oh there so you see i'm quite happy  that my incision of the mucosa is already more medial than the uo so i can instead of having  to look at the ui i can look at that reference to know that i'm safe with regards to the to the  you are other your weight now is preserved and now this is a tricky part in this case i found  that the size of the prostate was very very huge and it was somewhat difficult  to get to the posterior plane there so i tried to tackle it from the sides  to see if progressive mobilization would let me
  27. uh reach there now this is the other side i think  and again you see i'm trying to go from below try to separate adenoma from capsule my targeting  is very much you see against the adenoma i'm keeping the fiber against the the noma which is  above uh trying to protect the the capsule this allows to to to develop this  plane very very carefully without much risk of perforation i think it's  very very safe when you master this targeting to dissect the posterior plane i could feel the weight of the enoma on  my endoscope so you see it was becoming more and more difficult to to get there you see often you can push the normal a little  bit to the side and then you have access from above then you look for access from below  but this was this was really really big so
  28. so you know there's no absolutes in in surgery  and uh never say never and of course we have to be practical i think the benefit of the  block approach in this case is that we had excellent visibility all the time we had the  possibility of releasing the apex quite early and that protects the sphincter so the patient  is continent and this is very very very very important i think and then of course  we're coming to the end of the nucleation part of the operation see that's bladder neck and you know i go from one side to the other  seeing by seeing if i can progressively mobilize uh the adenoma to go from below  but in this case as i said i started realizing it was quite  challenging to release it completely
  29. so after thinking about it i decided to split the  anoma in the middle so most of the adenoma is now dissected the hemostasis is quite good but there  is still an attachment like six at six o'clock you know right there below the  anoma and uh you see the access gets a little bit more more challenging  and more difficult and when i started seeing that i couldn't progress  and as i said it's important to try to progress every minute i decided to to  do the split of the of the of the lobe sometimes when you split at six o'clock  the anoma gets a horseshoe shape and it gains some mobility so i went  inside prosthetic urethra and i started splitting of course now there is no almost no blood flow inside the the prostate the  enoma so the cut is totally blot less and
  30. i'm going to cut at five o'clock in the enormous so there is no so the middle lobe is going  to stay with the with the with the lateral lobe from from the other side that's the cutting is usually quite fast because  as i said there is no there's no worry about going too deep and there is no bleeding it's just  a maneuver to allow for a little bit better mobilization of of the enoma and hopefully  to allow to push it into the into the bladder uh you might argue well why didn't you do a three  lobe technique from the beginning or two lope technique from the beginning well i as i said  i think the apical liberation is an advantage and also when you do an incision  to start procedure there will be
  31. blood from the mucosa coming into the bladder  that then is difficult to wash out so probably probably the visibility throughout the  procedure would have been a little bit worse because there's always this blood you know  that doesn't wash out so easily as when we work in this relatively small space so of course this is a massive case i think i  have had to do this splitting business a couple of times unsurprisingly with other glands  with a similar size i was able to to reach and i was able to dissect circumferentially  and i was able to negotiate the passage of the adenoma into the bladder so i think we  can never say never and well this was the way i solved the the problem i i couldn't reach  below there and i tried to gain some mobility
  32. and some access to that air region  by splitting the adenoma here we are just almost reaching of course now there's  some improved access improved mobility because the anomaly is not joined in in the  midline here is the split i'm trying to ascertain if here for example i'm already dissecting a  little bit of the area that was still attached coming from the inside trying to detach what is remaining and now from below and from the side  trying to see if i can get to that region you see it's quite a challenge to to  do this this is very large glance but having the beautiful hemostasis of of here  i was trying to mobilize the anoma to see if i could somehow rotate it flip it into  the bladder but again it was not so easy
  33. more or less i think the posterior  tissue was nearly nearly finished but here i could see some attachments and i was trying to flip their  number inside and it was not not responding here is a view from above ah there  is some attachment still so let's let's try to detach it here again i'm targeting close to  the anomaly you see so i don't want to to be but instead of from below i'm doing it from above  so now that there is a little bit more mobility and more liberation uh we can access this remote  locations that are somewhat difficult to reach see there's still some little attachments  there and i was hoping that when i released everything the mobility would be  much better and i could probably flip
  34. the anomaly in the bladder here again some of the attachments from below which are not attachment but just  a little bit of fluffy tissue there now it looked it looked finished but  i thought maybe i cannot mobilize this completely you know and still a little so it's a fight you see as a surgeon you have to keep calm  and try to judge what is your next move here i thought if i split the anterior part as  well then i will have two lobes and then i can probably negotiate the passage of one of the  lobes into the bladder smaller lobe at least then we'll have more space more  mobility and i will be able to finish so there has to be a plan b and plan  c of how to behave and what to do here i'm splitting the anterior  commissure again without bleeding
  35. just to allow me to finalize the  dissection and hopefully to [Music] flip the adenoma into the bladder so that's the 12 o'clock split probably coming to an end that's the blaring itself here you can see now how the split  is being finalized finalized and yeah you have to do what you  have to do you have to be patient relax and think carefully what  is going to be your next step um sometimes in hollap when you have a difficult  case you tend to despair you know you tend to to think i'm not going to finish this i'm you are  there i saw you know even a little bit more attachment that i couldn't  see before so this further split gave me more access to  try to [Music] finally finally be able to detach this part
  36. and as i said you should develop  this ability to remain calm and of course technically fresh in the sense that  if you have to take a decision you shouldn't be feeling that way you know you  shouldn't be feeling in despair and in panic you know just relax things what think  what is going on and and do what you have to do um you know we are have a patient which is uh  without pain we are using saline saline irrigation he is not bleeding so the capsule  is is not perforated in a bad way so we are just you know in the middle of a  difficult operation we have to take a deep breath and relax and continue you know and then this kind  of faith in the method and the faith in your good ability to progress and to think and to take
  37. proper decisions will take you to a good end  it's incredible how this psychological stuff is important when you're in the middle of  an operation especially when you face cases that are not common they're not usual you know  remaining calm is great of course we have to keep the patient safety first in the sense that  if you have to quit you have to recognize that you're we're not able to pull it off  you know then it doesn't matter you put a catheter you tell the patient that's not safe  to continue and you come back another day or or as as i said at the beginning you know it's a  possibility in this very large cases to say to the patient i might need to open a little you know  incision to to to open the bladder and take the
  38. tissue out or you know proceed to have a second  second stage you know second stages were done for turp for example of large glands many times many  surgeons would and this is the end you see that this attachment gave us a hard time but this  is now the the last attachment of the left lobe of the patient let's see if we can flip it  inside the bladder i think it's wanting to go now and it went and it went so it is now a little bit easier to go under the other lobe  to check under the middle lobe and the the right level patient there's more space there's  more mobility to cut the last attachments so this was a nice maneuver to provide  access in this in this huge remaining lobe it seems it can be mobilized and i couldn't  see i couldn't find more more attachments in this
  39. side so i decided to [Music] move on to to more  selection once i saw that i could mobilize it i could move it but i couldn't properly flip  it into the bladder so we are used to do uh sometimes intracapsular morcellation and that's  what i decided i thought yeah we have to move on let's try to morsel it when we merciless  the piece will get smaller and if there was a small attachment we will be able to  see it so this is the change of instruments i'm using now the morse scope the adapted to get in there see i'm inside the fossa  and i will start the marcellation of course i don't want to punish you with one hour and  a half more selection time so i have edited the the morcellation it took us a little while  i tried sometimes upside down like the japanese
  40. urologists like to do i tried to to see i  think we had a problem that day with the vacuum we found out later that if we put a little  bit of an isolating tape in the connections we we get better suction you see  the suction was not totally good but we slowly progressed and we were able to  morcellate the middle lobe and the right lobe inside the fossa initially and then move on to to mercellate the  left lobe that was left inside the bladder so yeah one hour and a half a nucleation time  is a little bit long i was expecting to do it uh faster but i i found this difficulty to reach  the six o'clock region so we had to do the split and that took a little bit longer and then again  the more selection one hour and a half took
  41. us maybe too long i would have expected to do it  in 45 minutes uh 50 minutes something like that it is true that very large pieces have  a lot of inertia and the more slater has more problems sucking them in but of course in this very large gland sometimes we found we  find that the tissue is quite soft this was the end of the marsulation of the two pieces and i  decided to go in to check to do the final check and well that is the fossa that is the the trigon i couldn't see any any pieces initially  but uh there's typically a clot when you're mostly in the bladder there's a clot forming that's  a sphincter which is looking quite healthy and so we managed to despite the split at 12 o'clock  that i caused when i went into the bladder
  42. uh in the mukusa i think the sphincter is in good  shape here i found a little piece so i you see just cut a little and try to drag it out through  the urethra it came out it was a remaining piece and i went back to check you know finally how  the if there was any bleeder going of course the bladder has been distended for quite a while  so there's some oozing some bleeding that can remain but i couldn't see any significant vessels  going on and i i decided to to put a catheter so tough case tiring case but happy patients  the next morning he couldn't believe his flaw and it's well one of these difficult cases  that we have to humbly approach and treat this was the amount of tissue we took out it was  quite a large amount of tissue in a big bucket
  43. and this is the pathologic report with where  the pathologist weighted 369 grams so if you bear it with me the whole video i thank you  for your patience and attention and i hope it will help you when you have to tackle  your own difficult cases thank you very much

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